Let's give "stop hunting" a rest

[tim_nn]

Originally Posted by carson

This isn't to say stop hunting doesn't go on - it does, but is carried out by very big fish that move the entire market to where the stops are.

Absolutely. Well said, that man. (But I'm afraid that's not at all what rockinride was referring to. Meanwhile, I'm with Bob.)

[autofx]

Originally Posted by tim_nn

Absolutely. Well said, that man. (But I'm afraid that's not at all what rockinride was referring to. Meanwhile, I'm with Bob.)

You wanna move the markets and take out stops some day, too?

[tim_nn]

Originally Posted by autofx

You wanna move the markets and take out stops some day, too?

Chance, as the saying goes, would be A Fine Thing

[ash71]

Bob, Tim nn:

I am with you guys. Besides brokerages like ACM which actually apply individual account execution / spread & price manipulation algorhthyms based on a clinical study of an individuals trading style, traders who think their brokerage is "hunting" their 1 lot, 10-15 pip stops are passing the buck and deferring responsibilty for their own trading problems to the easiest target: The Evil Broker.

I think it has been covered weel in these forums. Brokerages run their price data through their own recources which calculate a tick-by-tick cost/bennefit and risk analysis of the prices they hang and how/when/where to move them. Thats their business, there are many well-conceived posts on that matter, and I have never really had a problem with stop hunting over the course of hundreds of trades.In fact, I have hunted more of my own stops.

Really, the fear-of-stop-hunting crowd would do well to understand their stops are more in jeoparady of being hit because they are making bad trade calls for a list of reasons, the least not of which is the trade-affecting psychology of having a constant suspicion of their brokerage!

Thanks for the good posts guys!

[el cid]

Hi Folks

This forum and thread is biased towards promoting advertising space for brokers and run to promote brokers.

If the Forum relied on income from traders , the title would have read Let's see how brokers really hunt for stops and succeed in screwing traders .

To confirm my view the complaints about brokers are right at the bottom of the message board in due diligegence board , so very few readers get the time to get to read the last page.

So I suggest you guys cut this crap

http://www.moneytec.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13181

El Cid

[Chris Hood]

This quote is true in every respect: "[T]he complaints about brokers are right at the bottom of the message board in due diligence board , so very few readers get the time to get to read the last page."

Last year, before I joined the board, I performed what I thought was due diligence on a Danish FX dealer, then opened a six-figure USD account with that dealer, only to be promptly burned by the dealer's price manipulation and refusal to honor my orders. Cost me and those with me 12k. Had I had access to accurate and honest information on the bucket operations of the dealer, and the similar dishonesty of FX dealers like it (most of whom pose as brokers when in fact they are dealers, ie., trading for themselves against their customers), I would have steered clear of the dealer and saved a lot of money, not to mention the loss of time and the heartache.

So, to help others avoid the costly mistakes and problems I encountered, I believe the board should give greater, not lesser, prominence to information on the dishonesty (or honesty as the case may be) of the dealers who are seeking new accounts. There are many neophytes out there who could save a ton of money with that information.

[ash71]

Chris Hood, El Cid:

I am not sure I understand the frustration towards the direction of this thread. Including my last post it would appear that what is taking shape here, as initiated by Bob, is an examination of the idea that most stop hunting complaints are unjustified and due more to trader error than brokerage intervention. That, unfortunately, is true- due to the fact that most people trading forex are very new to the practice and placing 10-15, sometimes even 20 pip stops in any market will eventually get you stopped out by the noise even in a smooth trend, IMHO.

Chris, I read your earlier post on Saxo and found it very helpful when I was looking for a new broker, toying with the idea that "Banks" were a true anonymous trading environment. Thanks for the "due dilligence", that could have saved ME money, ad I was considering them at the top of the list. When I first visited moneytec last year to research ACM I found only a few threads, and most were questions about ACM, not answers or posts from any long term real account holders. If I had found a good thread that expressed a similar combination of experiences to my own after having a live account w/ them, I would have saved a lot of money as well.

The most valuable aspect of Moneytec so far and by far for me has been research into brokerage dishonesty and the exposure of particularly unethical firms. These forums have saved me time and money, thanks to others willing to share their experiences with the various brokers. Clearly, there are only a few that provide any type of level playing field and I credit this forum for providing me with direction on this matter.

That does not mean that there isn't any truth to the idea that stop hunting can get a bit overplayed.

[autofx]

I do think stop hunting is real.

And some brokers are doing that to their customers, and worse. These
brokers should be put out of business, in my opinion.

I'm not saying these bad activities don't go on.

What I am saying is:

You are responsible for the broker you pick. "Due diligence" should be taken
very seriously. In the world's largest financial market, don't deposit your
hard-earned money with someone you haven't done your best to assess.
Ask around. Troll the Internet for information and opinions on the broker.
Call them with random questions, pretending to be dumber than you are.
See how they treat you and how consistent their answers are.

You are responsible for every aspect of your wins and losses. You choose to
trade or not. You decide when. You decide why.

You. The person in the mirror.

See, most people are very uncomfortable with this much freedom and the
responsibility that comes with it. When the going gets tough, they revert
to a childlike state and try to blame someone else.

You must grow out of that to succeed at trading. There is no option.