Trading In The Zone and The Holy Grail

[efex.co.uk]

Originally posted by MickMason
lol, 'Autofx' and 'comenow', dumb and dumber (if that's possible!)

Which bit of this didn't you quite understand ....."All the automated systems posted on this forum lost money in the long run, that's a fact. Don't bother posting past-performance results either, we all know how much hindsight trading can make.....

I'm not impressed by claims made in books or on internet forums, you obviously are, which probably means you're gullible and easy prey for snakeoil salesmen like Autofx. I only believe what I see and up until now I have not seen an automated trading system which is profitable long-term. Autofx's 'systems' all lost money when he and Buff posted live trades, now he's posting past-performance results they miraculously make a fortune! Hmmm, call me cynical but...

'comenow' says "According to ur loser's logic, novices are all bad traders", well yes, they are in the majority, most of them lose, that hardly makes them good traders does it! In case you hadn't realised, making money is what counts in this game. As for your opinion of me personally, well I think you confuse me with someone who cares what you think, to me you're just another uneducated foul-mouthed troll who's obviously losing money and is resentful of anyone who isn't. (Tip: try learning how to trade!). As for me being, what was it, oh yes "the greatest trader since Livermore", well not quite but I make money, trading is what I do, I enjoy it immensely and so does my bank balance!

And finally Bob 'Autofx', hmmm, well I could be here all night taking him apart but to be honest it's a bit of a pointless exercise and wouldn't reveal much that we don't already know about him and his trading 'experience' and '50-buck snake oil systems'. Bob my friend, learn to trade, it's great fun and extremely rewarding in many many respects, try it. I see you're on the prowl for a profitable trading system with your comments of "neither Smurf nor MickMason nor any of that ilk can point to any coherent set of entry/exit criteria in ANY time frame, and show any evidence, whether real or fake, that they have the slightest clue how to actually trade.....and this gem...."NOW......let's see YOUR threads and YOUR trading records and detailed descriptions of YOUR trading strategies!", well no need to get so upset and aggressive about it Bob, all you had to do was ask politely or better still read the forums! I'll help you, here's a link to a preview of the trading strategy I use. Now before you or your dumber friend ask, no, neither of you would pass the 'aptitude test to weed out the hopeless and hapless', some people are way beyond help so don't waste your time asking, besides which I doubt you could afford the fees, they're a tad more than 50 bucks

Moneytec is a valuable resource for those looking to get into this business and traders wanting to improve their skills, and a place where like-minded traders can discuss issues, sadly it's being overrun by graffiti from vandals and snake oil salesmen, what a waste of a good resource.

Perhaps I'll come back later when pest-control have been in, in the meantime.........

I wish you all a Happy and Prosperous New Year (yes, even you Dumb and Dumber, you never know, miracles do happen!)




Mick

A Happy and Prosperous New Year!

[Smurf]

autofx, dear autofx, has it now come to this? You're now backing up your claims with garyh's thread? It's so sad. Is your double-smoothed MACD... sorry ... is your break-out system ... sorry ... is your three lows / highs system in trouble perhaps? Don't worry, there are still so many systems out there and giving your web site a make-over is easy. I have just looked at it, by the way. The visual experience is much better than it used to be, but I couldn't find any mentioning of your old systems, which was odd, because the rhetorics sounded familiar. Don't you think it would be fait to inform your readers and potential customers that you change systems often?

When you quote me, it would be wonderful if you answered the question first. Since you apparently believe religiously in mechanical systems and the idea of cutting your losses short, why do 90% of all systems degrade in their overall profitability when you introduce stop losses? It's a simple question. Surely, a guru in computerised trading such as yourself can shed light on this interesting issue. But then you never really answer questions, do you?

If you notice one or several people having a problem with you, it's because you're selling something. And what you have to sell is not worth anything, because you very clearly haven't got the faintest grasp of anything related to this business. As you have demonstrated so often, you cannot even do simple math.

In closing, I would like to suggest an idea to you. It's very simple. People who can trade, do so. They do so with their own money or they are employed by trading firms in one way or another. They do not give their trading methodology away to strangers and they do not sell it for something like $150/mo. WHEN people offer services such as your's for $150/mo., then very clearly it doesn't work. If you should one day stumble upon a winning system or steal it from garyh or whatever, you wouldn't sell it for peanuts, now would you?

Cheers,

Smurf

[comenow]

Originally posted by bobnat


Are you aware of the fact that Seykota sells a $2,000 trend following system? I know a guy that bought it and he let me read it. It is absolutely nothing that you can't get for free off the internet. Did you know that Seykota has never published his track record except for a single customer account?

I'm not attacking you, but to blindly believe anyone in this field is being extremely naive. You are taking on faith all the stuff you've read about Seykota and all the other "legends" of trading. Understanding the limits of knowledge is essential here. We really don't know what he does or how he does it, we only have his word on it.

And as to why would he lie, that is one of the most naive questions you could possibly ask. People lie all the time for a multitude of reasons. The fact that you can't think of one doesn't preclude them from doing so. But the obvious reason why anyone involved with the trading world would lie is quite obvious, isn't it?

Here's the link to Seykota's site. Click on Orders to see his great system.

http://www.turtletrader.com/tribe.html

Nat

I got a problem. If i thoght like that, I would never believe anybody. I believe that Richard Dennis was an exceptionally good trader; I believe that Eckardt was his partner; i believe that they together trained the turtles; I believe that they used mechanical trading systems; I believe that Ed Seykota is a very successful trader; I believe that Livermore was a great trader. I believe all this on the basis of what I read. Whether u belive something or not is a matter of judgement based on all the available information. I don't understand the attitude which says that I have to disbelieve everyone who has anything to say about trading.

I will not buy a course for £250.00 or go on a £3000.00 a weekend course because I believe that a system which is any good will not be sold given that u can make a huge sum of money trading it. It makes sense to doubt the authenticty of stuff like that, but it also makes sense to believe the more credible stuff. Otherwise how do u learn?

[comenow]

Originally posted by MickMason


Which bit of this didn't you quite understand ....."All the automated systems posted on this forum lost money in the long run, that's a fact. Don't bother posting past-performance results either, we all know how much hindsight trading can make.....

Right, that is sufficient evidence that all automated systems are losers.

I'm not impressed by claims made in books or on internet forums, you obviously are, which probably means you're gullible and easy prey for snakeoil salesmen like Autofx.

Well i would not buy a signaling service from anyone. I am certainly not impressed by internet forum gits like you. But I am impressed by Livermore in trading or Einstein in physics. U are really a piece of work mate. "I am not impressed by books". What does that even mean? U r an embarassment.

I only believe what I see.

Really? Do u believe that Hitler was real? I assume u have never seen the sod. The other problem is that we have never seen u or ur pathetic attempt at trading, so followng ur logic, we should not believe that u trade, which I doubt any way.

and up until now I have not seen an automated trading system which is profitable long-term. Autofx's 'systems' all lost money when he and Buff posted live trades, now he's posting past-performance results they miraculously make a fortune! Hmmm, call me cynical but...

U see ur obsession about Autofx is really unhealthy. U have got to let it go.

'comenow' says "According to ur loser's logic, novices are all bad traders", well yes, they are in the majority, most of them lose, that hardly makes them good traders does it! In case you hadn't realised, making money is what counts in this game.

U can neither read or trade mate. I said 'all', you then said 'yes' and 'the majority'. All is different from the majority man dear fellow.

As for your opinion of me personally, well I think you confuse me with someone who cares what you think, to me you're just another uneducated foul-mouthed troll who's obviously losing money and is resentful of anyone who isn't.

I thought u only believe what u see. u clearly care about what others say about u otherwise u would not respond. How do u know that am not educated then? Dear me,u need to chill out bro.

(Tip: try learning how to trade!).

Ok sir.

As for me being, what was it, oh yes "the greatest trader since Livermore", well not quite but I make money, trading is what I do, I enjoy it immensely and so does my bank balance!

What do u want, a prize? I really could not care less whether u make money or not.


I wish you all a Happy and Prosperous New Year (yes, even you Dumb and Dumber, you never know, miracles do happen!)


Oh dear!!



Mick [/b]

[Smurf]

Hello autofx

I completely forgot to mention that since it's holiday season, I have time to entertain a hobby of mine: documentaries. And I'm doing one on you! You simply cannot ask for better publicity. It's right here .

I'd personally hate to lose all your writings even though you edit your own posts weeks later. Enjoy.

Cheers,

Smurf

[autofx]

Great stuff!

Hilarious!!!

[KPcurrency]

I've seen some good posts by you up to this point. Although I do not trade Elliot/Fibonacci, I do think there may be some underlying structure of the market that Elliot /Fibonacci is close to capturing. Profitable trading is not a function of knowing said structure.

Anyway that is not what this post is about. If one was to follow your logic about stop losses, one would have to conclude that a system with no stop loss is best. The numbers would bear this out, but, and this is a big but, most traders do not have unlimited funds and therefore would run the risk of ruin before a system could be profitable.

If I had all the money in the world, I would not need a stop loss. Now, if you lose 50% of 100.00 you lose 50. But to get back to 100 dollars you have to win 100% on next trade... That's why we use stops.

[Smurf]

Dear autofx

Try answering questions, in your own time of course, rather than making general statements as you always do. Since your web site doesn't really specify why your systems are changing or how you think you can run a business without being able to do simple, simple math, or why you keep backing up your trading philosophy with links to sites that either say the opposite or threads that aren't yours, or why you seem unable to answer questions on your specialty (computerised trading), this, my friend, is your chance to SHINE. Let's have it, autofx. Give it to us straight!

Cheers,

Smurf